10,000 touches a day

Global Game
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10,000 touches a day

This sentence stood out for me - thinking of Tuiloma who has played in every position on the pitch, or what merrick is seeking with some players; how important is the ability to play multiple positions, vs specialisation in a position? Thoughts?

Styles in Spain (tiki-taka), Italy (catenaccio), France (carré magique) and Germany (gegenpressing) all utilise tactics requiring technically sound players with the ability to interchange positions on the pitch: a skill acquired through relentless repetition.

Kotahitanga. We are one.

Jerzy Merino
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Global Game wrote:

10,000 touches a day

This sentence stood out for me - thinking of Tuiloma who has played in every position on the pitch, or what merrick is seeking with some players; how important is the ability to play multiple positions, vs specialisation in a position? Thoughts?

Styles in Spain (tiki-taka), Italy (catenaccio), France (carré magique) and Germany (gegenpressing) all utilise tactics requiring technically sound players with the ability to interchange positions on the pitch: a skill acquired through relentless repetition.

Talk to Declan. Then get a life.

"At the end of the drive the lawmen arrive...

I'll take my chance because luck is on my side or something...

Her name is Rio, she don't need to understand...

Oh Rio, Rio, hear them shout across the land..."

Global Game
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JM, not really a meaningful contribution unless you expand on your comment

Kotahitanga. We are one.

Jerzy Merino
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the phrase 'relentless repetition' kinda does it for me.

"At the end of the drive the lawmen arrive...

I'll take my chance because luck is on my side or something...

Her name is Rio, she don't need to understand...

Oh Rio, Rio, hear them shout across the land..."

Global Game
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OK, it's not for you. Seem to work pretty well for the Dutch though.

Kotahitanga. We are one.

foal30
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If you can play 1 position better than anyone else you'll always get picked

Coaches like to have on field options

Being technically adept is not the most important reasoning behind any players ability to be multi-positional

I liked the article bringing up the question "what is the actual desired end result". 


for instance using the Coerver model with 10000 touches regime would improve both ASB Prem and Mainland MPL / WPL in 6-8 years time. 






Edited by foal30 February 20, 2014 11:02

E's Flat Ah's Flat Too

Jeff Vader
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Sometimes being versatile is actually to your detriment. Can't think of any examples in football but I was thinking rugby with players never being able to crack the starting rotation because they offer more being versatile from the bench to slot in anywhere.

Grumpy old bastard alert

N-Bomb
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Same with baseball - if you can cover every position defensively but don't stand out at one place, then you're probably going to be a utility guy.

It's pretty hard to doubt the 10,000 touches ruling - it's simple that more and more practice will easily make you a better technical player, it's just to make it to a high level you also have to have the physical elements - strength, build, speed, toughness etc

foal30
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Yeah it's seldom mentioned but Genetics are a major player in who is able to perform on a world stage. 

There is a book recently released that hacks into the 10000 hour theory. 

E's Flat Ah's Flat Too

azza67
Trialist
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N-Bomb wrote:

Same with baseball - if you can cover every position defensively but don't stand out at one place, then you're probably going to be a utility guy.

It's pretty hard to doubt the 10,000 touches ruling - it's simple that more and more practice will easily make you a better technical player, it's just to make it to a high level you also have to have the physical elements - strength, build, speed, toughness etc


Add to that vision, spacial awareness and the right decision making process
Global Game
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N-Bomb wrote:

Same with baseball - if you can cover every position defensively but don't stand out at one place, then you're probably going to be a utility guy.

It's pretty hard to doubt the 10,000 touches ruling - it's simple that more and more practice will easily make you a better technical player, it's just to make it to a high level you also have to have the physical elements - strength, build, speed, toughness etc


This is tired typical old english/nz/aussie soccer thinking.
Xavi, iniesta, - are they strong? welterweight physique? fast? built like brick sh1thouse? no, no, no, no, no.
What they do have is great technique and read the game so intelligently and amazing spatial awareness.
Edited by Global Game February 21, 2014 13:10

Kotahitanga. We are one.

Paolo
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azza67 wrote:
N-Bomb wrote:

Same with baseball - if you can cover every position defensively but don't stand out at one place, then you're probably going to be a utility guy.

It's pretty hard to doubt the 10,000 touches ruling - it's simple that more and more practice will easily make you a better technical player, it's just to make it to a high level you also have to have the physical elements - strength, build, speed, toughness etc


Add to that vision, spacial awareness and the right decision making process


Yes these things end up setting the best players who all put in time and work apart! Hence why you wouldn't bother talking to Declan as he wouldn't have a clue about teaching, let alone teaching these things.
N-Bomb
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Global Game wrote:
N-Bomb wrote:

Same with baseball - if you can cover every position defensively but don't stand out at one place, then you're probably going to be a utility guy.

It's pretty hard to doubt the 10,000 touches ruling - it's simple that more and more practice will easily make you a better technical player, it's just to make it to a high level you also have to have the physical elements - strength, build, speed, toughness etc


This is tired typical old english/nz/aussie soccer thinking.
Xavi, iniesta, - are they strong? welterweight physique? fast? built like brick sh1thouse? no, no, no, no, no.
What they do have is great technique and read the game so intelligently and amazing spatial awareness.

I think you underestimate their speed, strength and fitness. Midfield is certainly the place where the physical elements I mentioned matter the least, if you're a target man, central striker or defender, you obviously defenitiely can't just rely on technique alone.
Believe me, I am one of the more-favoured towards technical play. I hate people hoofing it forward, ala Stoke, West Ham etc. I also believe strongly in the 10,000 hours theory of Gladwell. It's just you can't solely preach the technical stuff, because often you can then you end up with a bunch of players who can win tackles, headers, or get past people with speed (and occasionally, can't shoot).
Jerzy Merino
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"Chris Milicich, former NZ soccer coach of the year and national Under-20 coach, is heading up the newly formed St Peter's College academy as well as taking the reigns of the First X1.  He is quick to quash suggestions the academy has been set up to rival the work done by the likes of Kevin Fallon at MAGS or Fanny Hay at Sacred Heart. "It's for kids who want to be soccer players", he says. "It's about longterm development, it's not about St Peters teams winning. It's about developing footballers. The byproduct is that St Peters teams will get better by default. the learning curve for the players is strongly down the 'game intelligence' route c.f. at what would be a more traditional academy. "Game intellgence is better than skill development," he says. " I've stood on two sidelines at World Cups and our players just aren't smart enough."

The academy focuses on players in years 7 -10 and Milicich likes what he has seen so far from the 52 who are training four mornings a week. That number may be trimmed to 42. St Peters school has some 22 football teams.

- from yesterday's NZ Herald: School sport section.

Good luck Chris. You'll need it.

Edited by Jerzy Merino March 20, 2014 12:26

"At the end of the drive the lawmen arrive...

I'll take my chance because luck is on my side or something...

Her name is Rio, she don't need to understand...

Oh Rio, Rio, hear them shout across the land..."

Jeff Vader
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Interesting. I disagree in that our biggest issue is our players do not have a quality first touch. You look at Nelsen, Reid and Rojas. Those guys have a deft first touch and it creates them so much time to be able to do what they want. Our guys 2nd touch is usually a tackle. I think improving the first touch buys our players so much time and slows the game down for them to make the right decisions. Watch the CWC and the first touch of the ACFC guys vs the opponents. You can see the difference it makes.

Grumpy old bastard alert

Jerzy Merino
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Jeff Vader wrote:

Interesting. I disagree in that our biggest issue is our players do not have a quality first touch. You look at Nelsen, Reid and Rojas. Those guys have a deft first touch and it creates them so much time to be able to do what they want. Our guys 2nd touch is usually a tackle. I think improving the first touch buys our players so much time and slows the game down for them to make the right decisions. Watch the CWC and the first touch of the ACFC guys vs the opponents. You can see the difference it makes.

Lot of it about at the ACFC Under-17's. Fitter they are, the more tackles fly in. Chris M would weep.

"At the end of the drive the lawmen arrive...

I'll take my chance because luck is on my side or something...

Her name is Rio, she don't need to understand...

Oh Rio, Rio, hear them shout across the land..."

martinb
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Jerzy Merino wrote:

"Chris Milicich, former NZ soccer coach of the year and national Under-20 coach, is heading up the newly formed St Peter's College academy as well as taking the reigns of the First X1.  He is quick to quash suggestions the academy has been set up to rival the work done by the likes of Kevin Fallon at MAGS or Fanny Hay at Sacred Heart. "It's for kids who want to be soccer players", he says. "It's about longterm development, it's not about St Peters teams winning. It's about developing footballers. The byproduct is that St Peters teams will get better by default. the learning curve for the players is strongly down the 'game intelligence' route c.f. at what would be a more traditional academy. "Game intellgence is better than skill development," he says. " I've stood on two sidelines at World Cups and our players just aren't smart enough."

The academy focuses on players in years 7 -10 and Milicich likes what he has seen so far from the 52 who are training four mornings a week. That number may be trimmed to 42. St Peters school has some 22 football teams.

- from yesterday's NZ Herald: School sport section.

Good luck Chris. You'll need it.

St Peters have got a good little futsal turf that is just what we need all over the country if we're serious about developing close control...

pacy

Jerzy Merino
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Lessons in technique (no. 341) - the squirrel tackle: grab those nuts.


 

Edited by Jerzy Merino April 23, 2014 14:31

"At the end of the drive the lawmen arrive...

I'll take my chance because luck is on my side or something...

Her name is Rio, she don't need to understand...

Oh Rio, Rio, hear them shout across the land..."

Jerzy Merino
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For post pirate mickey

Lessons in technique (No. 367)  - Gamesmanship : Don't bite off more than you can chew.

"At the end of the drive the lawmen arrive...

I'll take my chance because luck is on my side or something...

Her name is Rio, she don't need to understand...

Oh Rio, Rio, hear them shout across the land..."

Jerzy Merino
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For post pirate mickey

azza67 wrote:
N-Bomb wrote:

Same with baseball - if you can cover every position defensively but don't stand out at one place, then you're probably going to be a utility guy.

It's pretty hard to doubt the 10,000 touches ruling - it's simple that more and more practice will easily make you a better technical player, it's just to make it to a high level you also have to have the physical elements - strength, build, speed, toughness etc

Add to that vision, spacial awareness and the right decision making process

"When it becomes serious, Marco holds often too long the ball hits the wrong decisions." Frank Kramer, coach of Spvgg Greuther Furth, explaining why our Marco isn't getting much game time in Deutchland. 

- see Marco thread on NZ players overseas

"At the end of the drive the lawmen arrive...

I'll take my chance because luck is on my side or something...

Her name is Rio, she don't need to understand...

Oh Rio, Rio, hear them shout across the land..."

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