He played up top often on the left... had a couple nice touches but rarely saw the ball.
Ryan Thomas (PEC Zwolle | Netherlands)
Well done Ryan.....is he the same lad that tore up and down the flank playing at RB for the Olympic team?
He will get good coaching in Holland. Even if all this kids playing in Europe like Ryan and Howieson, Tuiloma etc don't make the big time they still will be much better players for their time there. The AW's team for the 2018?? World Cup campaign is going to have some very good young talent......all they need to do is sort out the team coach.
That was Adam Thomas, who I thought got better as Olympics wore on. Not sure where he is now though
Well done Ryan.....is he the same lad that tore up and down the flank playing at RB for the Olympic team?
He will get good coaching in Holland. Even if all this kids playing in Europe like Ryan and Howieson, Tuiloma etc don't make the big time they still will be much better players for their time there. The AW's team for the 2018?? World Cup campaign is going to have some very good young talent......all they need to do is sort out the team coach.
That was Adam Thomas, who I thought got better as Olympics wore on. Not sure where he is now though
I've been asking same. But nobody answers.
I thought Adam Thomas had moved to Team Wellington.
Could debut for reserves next week. Reserves play in beloften eredivisie the highest reserve league in dutch football
Awesome. Keep us posted.
ahh yeah, was confused between Adam Thomas and Ryan- so can anyone explain who he is and how he managed to get signed to dutch topflight?
Player from Waikato/BOP region, played under Declan Edge at Melville and Waikato FC before Edge got fired, moved down to play for I think Suburbs (whoever lost to Wainui in the Cup), and play at the Ole Academy.
Huge talent, piqued plenty of clubs interest at the U20 WC, plus Ole have some decent overseas connections.
Gained interest from the u20 World Cup.... wow thats surprising considering how bad we were across the park.
I'd imagine this had more to do with contacts than anything if we are even looking at how we went as a marketing tool.
Some of you are so un-educated on what Declan is trying to imply on his players. Declan couldn't care less if he wins, looses or draws, what's important to him is the development of his players. If his players are completing on average 700+ passes a game this improves every single aspect of their game, it gets them on the ball a heap, helps with awareness and forces the players to make the right decisions. These players are young and in the most important phase of learning, whose going to remember Declan losing 5 years from now? Know one. Hes thinking long term for his players, not short term success. Declan's philosophy is the best for growing players and without a doubt you can't hold a strong arguement against that. If you enjoy watching teams launching the ball forward every chance they get then some of you are watching the wrong code. For the record, under Ole, Declan hasn't lost a single game against any side in Wellington, including the likes of Miramar, Olympic, Wests and many other teams. Declan also took Ryan in at a young age and housed him and looked after him for many years, so congratulations to both Ryan and Declan on his signing.
Some of you are so un-educated on what Declan is trying to imply on his players. Declan couldn't care less if he wins, looses or draws, what's important to him is the development of his players. If his players are completing on average 700+ passes a game this improves every single aspect of their game, it gets them on the ball a heap, helps with awareness and forces the players to make the right decisions. These players are young and in the most important phase of learning, whose going to remember Declan losing 5 years from now? Know one. Hes thinking long term for his players, not short term success. Declan's philosophy is the best for growing players and without a doubt you can't hold a strong arguement against that. If you enjoy watching teams launching the ball forward every chance they get then some of you are watching the wrong code. For the record, under Ole, Declan hasn't lost a single game against any side in Wellington, including the likes of Miramar, Olympic, Wests and many other teams. Declan also took Ryan in at a young age and housed him and looked after him for many years, so congratulations to both Ryan and Declan on his signing.
Good post.....people like Declan and Rufer often get flack because they are a little non conventional. At the end of the day it does not matter because if they can produce kids like Thomas and get them into good clubs in Europe then all well and good.
You don't have to convince me of the need for someone to be training our youngsters how to pass and move....its been our biggest weakness for ever. Watching our senior AW team trying to move the ball about against UAE was painfull.
I don't think anyone really questions what Declan's end goal is. The question is pulling out stats and other throw away lines trying to make them validate what they are doing. I agree that first touch is everything and as a football population, ours is poor. Just watch CWC and ACFC and you will see the difference a first touch makes because it's glaringly obvious. I think his ideals of a short passing game are good and staying away from a long ball game. I get he does not care about the results he gets, but those kids have to move into another environment to further their 'football career' where they will need to show more than just a first touch and a pass for a coach that does care about results
Now, as an example. 700+ passes a game. Now at WaiBOP/Melville, 75% of those would have been around the back 4. What we can possible draw from that is:
A: his teams could not play forward. How does this develop footballers ability to see the next pass or have players in front of the back 4 move into positions to receive a pass or develop a sense of building an attack?
B: the other 6 guys on the field were getting 25% of possession in his team - real development for them which would possibly show that they were not making themselves available to receive the ball or see point A
C: I can line 4 guys up and have them knock the ball around all day. What does it achieve? Great we strung 700 passes together. What does it mean in the context of a football game? It's a meaningless stat without anything to define it. The principles of football is possession, move forward and score. His teams tick 1 of those boxes.
If I sell you a tiger repelling rock on the principle that because you have this rock and don't see any tigers, thus it must work proves the exact same point with Declan that correlation does not equal causation. He does produce players with a good first touch and a solid pass. Within that, where is there sense of attacking intuition, defensive intuition and making smart football choices? It's almost like mass production of robots that can do one thing, and one thing only, but telling everyone that they are the total package.
The reality is, the way his teams PLAY, these kids are no better off sitting in the back yard kicking a ball against a wall 700 times because they get the same tactical awareness and sense of build that they would get playing in his teams. After all, it is 700 complete passes....
Again, I agree with what he is TRYING to get to, and I think he has the right basis of going about it, but don't trump out that because you can make 700 passes, that the kids are complete footballers or that it means something. He needs them to make those 700 passes meaningful in the context of a football game. You can define that as go forward and goals as an end result. I would also add that the difference between Declan and Wynton, is that his kids can do the 700 passes AND the rest. He won't just be talking about 700 passes though...
With all that above, it does not belong in this thread and I am guilty of that too.
Good luck to Ryan and his stint there.
continuing wrong thread stuf...
If this guy is a good kiwi coach is there any chance of him being involved in the Nix or AWs?
My dislike of Emblen is that he seems very similar to Ricki in background- a defensive player schooled in the British game. That and I would like the next AWs coach to be more ambitious and have a better background than the ASBP. It's an ideal and maybe not possible I know, but Ricki is part of the reason we were at the last WC. Ricki was an ambitious coach before he came to the Phoenix and the AWs and you could see his energy and belief in their play.
I'd like either more ambition or a chance for something different rather than two coaches of similar backgrounds working together...
I don't think anyone really questions what Declan's end goal is. The question is pulling out stats and other throw away lines trying to make them validate what they are doing. I agree that first touch is everything and as a football population, ours is poor. Just watch CWC and ACFC and you will see the difference a first touch makes because it's glaringly obvious. I think his ideals of a short passing game are good and staying away from a long ball game. I get he does not care about the results he gets, but those kids have to move into another environment to further their 'football career' where they will need to show more than just a first touch and a pass for a coach that does care about results
Now, as an example. 700+ passes a game. Now at WaiBOP/Melville, 75% of those would have been around the back 4. What we can possible draw from that is:
A: his teams could not play forward. How does this develop footballers ability to see the next pass or have players in front of the back 4 move into positions to receive a pass or develop a sense of building an attack?
B: the other 6 guys on the field were getting 25% of possession in his team - real development for them which would possibly show that they were not making themselves available to receive the ball or see point A
C: I can line 4 guys up and have them knock the ball around all day. What does it achieve? Great we strung 700 passes together. What does it mean in the context of a football game? It's a meaningless stat without anything to define it. The principles of football is possession, move forward and score. His teams tick 1 of those boxes.
If I sell you a tiger repelling rock on the principle that because you have this rock and don't see any tigers, thus it must work proves the exact same point with Declan that correlation does not equal causation. He does produce players with a good first touch and a solid pass. Within that, where is there sense of attacking intuition, defensive intuition and making smart football choices? It's almost like mass production of robots that can do one thing, and one thing only, but telling everyone that they are the total package.
The reality is, the way his teams PLAY, these kids are no better off sitting in the back yard kicking a ball against a wall 700 times because they get the same tactical awareness and sense of build that they would get playing in his teams. After all, it is 700 complete passes....
Again, I agree with what he is TRYING to get to, and I think he has the right basis of going about it, but don't trump out that because you can make 700 passes, that the kids are complete footballers or that it means something. He needs them to make those 700 passes meaningful in the context of a football game. You can define that as go forward and goals as an end result. I would also add that the difference between Declan and Wynton, is that his kids can do the 700 passes AND the rest. He won't just be talking about 700 passes though...
This this this this this THIS.
Here's the thing - Declan is good at producing talented, skillful individuals, there's no doubting that. The problem is, that if you put all those individuals in a team together, they either A) Can't score goals or B) Are coached by him. Besides - if his goal is really just to develop players, with no regards to winning, then why did he push so hard to be Melville or Waikato coach, both occasions which were dreadful failures?
That is why I wouldn't want him in a NZ or Nix set-up - yes he can create technically gifted footballers, but it takes a lot of work, and the end result is usually a bunch of losses, with one or two players who are good enough to succeed at a very high level.
Taking it back on topic, not that it needs to be - Ryan Thomas is one of those. He's more than just a nimble passer, he's got a bucketload of talent.
Thomas has got talent. I suspect he had though before Declan got him but I am open to being incorrect on that. He has got a similar game to Marco and that's exciting. I think he is too slight and soft on contact so would like to see him work on his professional game body. I remember reading a while back that he picked up a couple of cards for diving?
I agree with JV on this one. Played against Waikato 15th grade a few years ago at Federation tournament, when Declan coached and they had all the possesion, but we (FootballSouth) won 1-0 and from a defenders perspective it was the easiest game of the tournament. What I'm getting at is that while he seems to have done a great job coaching individuals, in a competitive situation possesion is more about quality than quantity.
I agree with JV on this one. Played against Waikato 15th grade a few years ago at Federation tournament, when Declan coached and they had all the possesion, but we (FootballSouth) won 1-0 and from a defenders perspective it was the easiest game of the tournament. What I'm getting at is that while he seems to have done a great job coaching individuals, in a competitive situation possesion is more about quality than quantity.
Interesting debate - Declan probably has more future as a youth coach and that's no bad thing if that's his forte. Because contrary to popular opinion, and conservative football opinion, about lack of emphasis on winning at junior level as being "politically correct", many of the world's top clubs don't place much emphasis on winning at junior level but encourage things like retaining possession and developing individual skills.
There was an interesting interview with either Xavi or Iniesta last year in World Soccer magazine about Barcelona's way of doing things. He surprised me by saying that Barcelona don't place much emphasis on winning at youth level and their sides often lose - even often to local Barcelona side Espanyol, a much smaller club.
Seems to have been working for Barca in producing talented individuals for their first team. It's obvious though that Barcelona place emphasis on quality as well as quantity of possession at senior level and producing winning results.
You have two teams of exact same players, skill, make up and playing style. One strings together 700 passes and does nothing with it, the other strings 500 together and scores 2 goals and creates several chances. All things being even with two equally matched teams, it's obvious that the team that made less passes had a better clue about how to use the ball when they had it.
This is fundamentally what I am getting at and the major flaw in what Declan's teams/players do. I'm not suggesting we or Declan should be results orientated. For me, it's about possession for the sake of it vs possession and being able to make it into something. Simplified by Homies phrase 'quantity vs quality'. They can make their 700 passes but none of them have a clue as to how to make the right/meaningful one or turn it into anything.
Has Thomas played yet?
Around in circles.
I could care less if Declan doesn't win, but he seems to be doing something right with his current philosophy with YOUTH players which appears to be similar to Barca... , either that or something in the Waikato water!
On topic please people. If you want to debate the merits of edge create another thread.
Will start deleted off topic posts.
Around in circles.
I could care less if Declan doesn't win, but he seems to be doing something right with his current philosophy with YOUTH players which appears to be similar to Barca... , either that or something in the Waikato water!
Similar to Barca? Let's not get carried away.
Can we take this convo to the coaching chat forum? I like it, but it doesn't belong here. Someone start (or rejuvinate) a Declan thread...
On topic please people. If you want to debate the merits of edge create another thread.
Will start deleted off topic posts.
What he said.
Strangely, Ryan now has his own Wikipedia page in Spanish but not in English. Guess they just care more about football than we do:
http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryan_Thomas_(futbolista)
Quite comprehensive for a young player's entry - a Spanish speaker has done some good research there.
Just checked who established this Wikipedia page and it's an Argentinian called Martin from Rosario, Argentina who is interested in New Zealand and Oceania football ("but not Australia") and goes by the Wikipedia name NZF..
Good guy! He knows his stuff too and has created Spanish language entries on many aspects of NZ and Oceania football.
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Ryan's Zwolle youth team squad - "Jong PEC Zwolle":
http://www.transfermarkt.es/en/jong-pec-zwolle/startseite/verein_20300.html
The Dutch youth league "Beloften Eredivisie" tables (Jong Zwolle is sixth in 11 team Group One after four games):
http://www.transfermarkt.es/en/beloften-eredivisie/tabelle/wettbewerb_NLBE.html
Jong PEC Zwolle schedule and results: http://www.transfermarkt.es/en/jong-pec-zwolle/spielplan/verein_20300.html
They've only played one game since Ryan signed - 16/9/13 v NEC Nijmegen 0-2 loss
Next match: 30/9/13 v ADO Den Haag
I'm finding the PEC Zwolle official website can't currently be accessed.
A cached version only is available here: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:http://www.peczwolle.nl/nl/laatste-nieuws_1
Youth team fixtures, results and match reports: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:http://www.peczwolle.nl/nl/uitslagen_1
No info available as to whether Ryan Thomas played in that last game.
Strangely, Ryan now has his own Wikipedia page in Spanish but not in English. Guess they just care more about football than we do:
http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryan_Thomas_(futbolista)
Quite comprehensive for a young player's entry - a Spanish speaker has done some good research there.
Just checked who established this Wikipedia page and it's an Argentinian called Martin from Rosario, Argentina who is interested in New Zealand and Oceania football ("but not Australia") and goes by the Wikipedia name NZF..
Good guy! He knows his stuff too and has created Spanish language entries on many aspects of NZ and Oceania football.
I don't really understand the internets. Is it possible to contact him? Could be a good laugh to get him on the Pod.
maybe he's that Javier guy or related to him who pops up here to post from time to time...surely it is impossible to be interested in NZ football without having a YF login...
I know a few guys that don't but like me, are old cunts.
maybe he's that Javier guy or related to him who pops up here to post from time to time...surely it is impossible to be interested in NZ football without having a YF login...
That's my thinking. Javier is from Argentina and is very keen on us. He normally has has quite good things to say (except for the siggy tackle????).
Strangely, Ryan now has his own Wikipedia page in Spanish but not in English. Guess they just care more about football than we do:
http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryan_Thomas_(futbolista)
Quite comprehensive for a young player's entry - a Spanish speaker has done some good research there.
Just checked who established this Wikipedia page and it's an Argentinian called Martin from Rosario, Argentina who is interested in New Zealand and Oceania football ("but not Australia") and goes by the Wikipedia name NZF..
Good guy! He knows his stuff too and has created Spanish language entries on many aspects of NZ and Oceania football.
I don't really understand the internets. Is it possible to contact him? Could be a good laugh to get him on the Pod.
I'm no expert myself, Smithy, but here are his details on Wikipedia (sure has a lot of interest in football in this country and Oceania):
http://es.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Usuario:NZF
You can communicate with him here I think on Wiki after logging on to your Wiki account (use Google Translate):
http://es.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Usuario_Discusi%C3%B3n:NZF&action=edit§ion=new
Yay! PEC Zwolle official website now up after crashing last week.
And it reveals Ryan played his first game for the youth team Jong PEC Zwolle v Jong NEC Nijmegen 16/9/13 just over a week ago
Young PEC Zwolle - Young NEC / FC Oss Young 0-2 (0-2) Referee: Edwin Boat
Lineups:
Young NEC / FC Oss: Smits, Arnarson, Hultermans, Janssen, Salim el Abed, Diarra, Tutu Arima, Loen, Hemlein, Cilek, Jahanbakhsh
Young PEC Zwolle: Elmali, Usta, Epe, Talu, Nieuwenhuis, Fennich, Thomas, Patricio, Tihouna, Eloisghiri, Raševi?
Goals:
17. Hemlein (0-1)
44. Jahan Bakhsh Jirandeh (0-2)
Fixture list and links to match reports:
Actually played today against a German team, by the sounds of the report he played well and scored a nice goal aswell...
Tuesday played Young PEC Zwolle in IJsseldelta stadium an exhibition game against Young SV Meppen. The match against the German opponent was coach Gert Peter Grace a great opportunity to some young players, including A1-keeper Mike Hauptmeijer to work to see.
Zwolle promise team started the match well and seemed to come through Kadir Usta. Ahead early The attacker dribbled goalkeeper Benjamin Gommert, but saw that his goal was disallowed for offside. In the remainder of the first half Jong SV Meppen was getting stronger. Jan-Christian Meier was the seventeenth minute in a good chance from a corner kick, but his header hit the crossbar right. Moments later, the team from Germany seemed to open when Daniel was ?atkowski free shooting. Goal for the score However, his attempt hit the post, and Christian Düker the rebound wide open goal over lap. Young PEC Zwolle tried in the remainder of the first half a bit more pressure to put forward, but it was Young SV Meppen that the better team was. After 34 minutes of long distance Düker just shot on goal and a moment later it was again a possibility that Düker shot into the side netting. Through these missed opportunities both teams searched the locker room with a 0-0 draw.
Young SV Meppen started strong in the second half and came 51 minutes into the match 0-1, thanks to Timo Scherping. The German player could run free, after which he did with a subtle spring wire to pass. Hauptmeijer Not much later, Young PEC Zwolle back into the game. After good preparatory work by Anjur Osmanovic Youssef Fennich got the ball. However, the captain of the projectile shot back, and the leather landed at the feet of Usta. The striker remained calm and scored 1-1 with a diagonal shot past keeper Gommert. After 65 minutes Jong PEC Zwolle's Ryan Thomas went on an adventure. The New Zealand player dribbled by two players, after which he went alone to the keeper. With a shot into the near corner he tried to surprise Gommert but the keeper was alert and tipped the ball with a superb reflex next. Somewhat against the ratio was the Zwolle team that came on a 2-1 lead after 70 minutes. Osmanovic reached Thomas with a beautiful pass, after the midfielder remained calm and controlled the ball on the come-Jong SV Meppen-keeper over lap. The German team was in the remainder of the second half through Micah Langreder and Martin Wagner still opportunities, but both players had their sights not on edge. After 88 minutes it was even 3-1 in favor of Zwolle. Dean Patricio reached invader Djarno Hofland, who controlled the ball with a nice shot from the far corner against the ropes lap.
Monday, September 30 Young PEC Zwolle plays the next league match against ADO Den Haag Young. More information about the schedule is here to find.
Match statistics
Young PEC Zwolle - Young SV Meppen 3-1 (0-0)
Lineups:
Young PEC Zwolle: Hauptmeijer, Edge, Usta, Thomas, Nieuwenhuis, Makizodila, Pereira, Patricio, Fennich, Osmanovic and Eloisghiri.
Young SV Meppen: Gommert, Meier, ?atkowski, Beccaria, Wagner, Schmik, Wigger, Hahn, Schepers, Kacar and Scherping
Goals:
51. Tightening 0-1
55. Usta 1-1
70. Thomas 2-1
88. Hofland 3-1
Awesome
Sounds like Ryan was prominent in the 2-2 draw on Monday away to ADO Den Haag. Created the second PEC goal:
"With 58 minutes played, the team of coach Gert Peter Grace took the lead with a nice goal from Hiwat. After good preparatory work by Ryan Thomas finished off Hiwat controlled (1-2).In the remainder of the match Eloisghiri, Fennich and Thomas got good opportunities to tie the score at 1-3 but Zwolle players had their sights not on edge.Well into injury time came the Hagenezen still leveled by Van Veen (2-2).This ended the match in a draw."
Young ADO Den Haag - Young PEC Zwolle 2-2 (1-1)
Referee: Ingmar Oostrom
Lineups
Young ADO Den Haag:
Ebuehi, Bulut, Smith, Van Zwieten, Knol, Tira, Bunch, Kovalonoks, Destanovic, Calor, Jacobs
Young PEC Zwolle:
Borgman, Epe, Nieuwenhuis, Hofland, Talu, Tihouna, Patricio, Fennich, Thomas, Eloisghiri, Hiwat
Goals
26. Tira (1-0)
41. Eloisghiri (1-1)
59. Hiwat (1-2)
90 +2. Van Veen (2-2)
made the bench for the 6-1 win yesterday
Amazing stuff
Next week could be our 2nd player in Dutch top flight following the Godfather! Hope Ivan sends his congrats when it happens.
Thats pretty impressive. He's only really just arrived so to make the bench for the first team already is pretty special.... too late for the qualifiers, but when we get past Mexico he should probably expect a call up.
Awesome
Thats pretty impressive. He's only really just arrived so to make the bench for the first team already is pretty special.... too late for the qualifiers, but when we get past Mexico he should probably expect a call up.
Awesome
Yeah lets just see if he makes the first team yet before we do that...we've depth in front third for AW. Tuiloma diff story. Defensive stocks are low
Thats pretty impressive. He's only really just arrived so to make the bench for the first team already is pretty special.... too late for the qualifiers, but when we get past Mexico he should probably expect a call up.
Awesome
If we DON"T get past Mexico, he'll probably get a call up. NZF BOARD ALL OUT! New broom, fresh sweepings. DECLAN for AW MANAGER! Now that would be a story!