Fever Tech Team Outreach (Whine Here)

TreeFiddy
WeeNix
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For post hqdefault

Is there a tidier way to respond to multiple quotes without doing an entirely new post? Sometimes there's good discussion going with points relevant to what you're about to post and the current system means you've got to either neglect one or respond around the same point twice. 

I know it's possible on phpBB forums, so not sure what you're using in the back end here. 

Trying to do so just fails and generates something...

Tegal wrote:

Yeah, this is 2018. Young people can be cranky too. 

[/quote] 
Like

[quote=Christo]

yeah but I don’t need a notification for when I delete my account.

This


(not actually singling these lads out - just trying to illustrate a point using two entirely separate posts <3 )

RR
Bossi Insider
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For post a49a55578dbc3545891a3968b88a82c3

TreeFiddy wrote:

Is there a tidier way to respond to multiple quotes without doing an entirely new post? Sometimes there's good discussion going with points relevant to what you're about to post and the current system means you've got to either neglect one or respond around the same point twice. 

I know it's possible on phpBB forums, so not sure what you're using in the back end here. 

Trying to do so just fails and generates something...

Tegal wrote:

Yeah, this is 2018. Young people can be cranky too. 

[/quote] 
Like

[quote=Christo]

yeah but I don’t need a notification for when I delete my account.

This


(not actually singling these lads out - just trying to illustrate a point using two entirely separate posts <3 )

Its a custom built code, so it has a few quirks that other ones don't have.
AucklandPhoenix
Lawyerish
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For post picture 8258

for some reason whenever I type this web site onto my browser some dodgy looking Huawei thing comes up wanting me to fill in things

The second time it works

Is this the Chinese government hacking just me?

Or is it happening to everyone else?

Auckland will rise once more

RR
Bossi Insider
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For post a49a55578dbc3545891a3968b88a82c3

for some reason whenever I type this web site onto my browser some dodgy looking Huawei thing comes up wanting me to fill in things

The second time it works

Is this the Chinese government hacking just me?

Or is it happening to everyone else?

A screenshot might help the techies.
patrick478
Moderator
Assistant to the senior Intern
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For post siggy hit2

TreeFiddy wrote:

Is there a tidier way to respond to multiple quotes without doing an entirely new post? Sometimes there's good discussion going with points relevant to what you're about to post and the current system means you've got to either neglect one or respond around the same point twice. 

I know it's possible on phpBB forums, so not sure what you're using in the back end here. 

Trying to do so just fails and generates something...

Tegal wrote:

Yeah, this is 2018. Young people can be cranky too. 

[/quote] 
Like

[quote=Christo]

yeah but I don’t need a notification for when I delete my account.

This


(not actually singling these lads out - just trying to illustrate a point using two entirely separate posts <3 )

This is a known issue. We tried to fix it ages back but the code theoretically should be working (but obviously it isn't). It's above my pay grade to fix this so you might just have to deal with it, sorry.

Yellow Fever - Misery loves company

AucklandPhoenix
Lawyerish
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For post picture 8258

RR wrote:

for some reason whenever I type this web site onto my browser some dodgy looking Huawei thing comes up wanting me to fill in things

The second time it works

Is this the Chinese government hacking just me?

Or is it happening to everyone else?

A screenshot might help the techies.

How do you do a screen shot on na iPad?

Auckland will rise once more

Yakcall
Moderator
The Stat Yak
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For post elite

RR wrote:

for some reason whenever I type this web site onto my browser some dodgy looking Huawei thing comes up wanting me to fill in things

The second time it works

Is this the Chinese government hacking just me?

Or is it happening to everyone else?

A screenshot might help the techies.

How do you do a screen shot on na iPad?

https://www.digitaltrends.com/mobile/how-to-take-a-screenshot-ipad/amp/

Simultaneously press the Home button and Sleep/Wake button when viewing the screen you want to capture.

Player: "What bloody game are you watching ref?"

Ref: "The one where you've had three shots and haven't hit the target."

Hows my refereeing? Whine Here

paulm
Legend
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For post screenhunter 20 dec. 05 18.55

Is this the mod thread referred to in the Steven Taylor thread? 

If yes, my paste:

So it seems that many disagree with Napierphoenix' views, jokes, and his opposition to his own banning, which if fine, everyone is entitled to an opinion.

However, saying things like "I've never been banned" or "we couldnt care less why you were banned", are absurd justifications for an opposing point of view, particularly when consistency is his chief complaint.

I disagree wholeheartedly with Napierphoenix' heavy criticism of the moderators, but I agree with him that the behaviour of the moderators can be inconsistent. I will not criticise them for that though, because that is clearly not their intention. They are doing the best job they can, for free, and I'm sure they are trying to be as consistent and clear as possible. Unfortunately you just can't really achieve high levels of that in a volunteer environment when you are constantly pushed for time and money, I get that. That was why I suggested perhaps looking at adding detail to the forum rules so it's a little clearer. However even then, that's just off the top of my head, I haven't thought a lot about that, it may not work at all, it's just an idea.

I would also like to applaud Yakcall for his behaviour when moderating in this thread. Regardless of whether you agree with him or not (and I haven't agreed with some of it), it is clear that he is reading everything, listening to every opinion, and trying his best to make correct decisions based on that. He is not taking a default position and then shaping his behaviour/comments based on that, which is so common these days, it seems to me that he is addressing all comments on their merits, regardless of the person's identity etc. So I think he's great, even if we don't have the same opinions on a lot of stuff. Incidentally it seems we are losing that in the modern world to some degree - having basic civility with people who have opposing views to your own.

Napier Phoenix
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Well said Paulm. I have been a forum member from almost the beginning and have seen many members and moderators come and go and with some of us there is a history of disagreements on a wide range of matters. There is some baggage there with some and while I  don't want to be accused of being a conspiracy theorist, I think my banning on both occasions was probably a result of bias against me for one particular incident. One of the original founders of YF and up until about 12 months ago, a constant presence on the forum, disagreed with a football comment I made and called me a retard. I tracked him down at his work place and telephoned him and remonstrated with him because I found his comment offensive from a personal point of view and particularly because he had no knowledge of my own personal family situation when making that statement. He certainly wasn't banned for making that statement.

2nd Best, especially has made childish reference to my action in subsequent postings and if anyone was to look through the history of postings [heaven forbid] they would see some pretty rude and niggley responses, from him, to some of my regular comments - other moderators do the same. This is where my call for consistency comes from and NZ Dave's snarky comment of "you are in breach of rules 5 and 6" [or whatever] is plain bullshark - you only have to look at postings over a couple of days to see these and other rules broken by several people with no sanction at all. I'm not calling for a zero tolerance to the rules, just some common sense and fairness - I'm not seeing that.  

I've already said [numerous times over a number of years] that I appreciate all of the hard volunteer work put into YF and this forum by the group we lovingly label 'the elite' but in running such a site [even on a voluntary basis] there is an obligation to run it fairly and be transparent in how sanctions are applied. Pointing out you were in breach of rules 4,5,6 and 7] is not being transparent at all. To many people, that have a sense of fair play, this is unacceptable and I would bet that a number of people no longer belong to this forum because of some of the antics of moderators and certain other posters. Its all very well saying 'if you don't like it, go somewhere else' but anyone involved in marketing will tell you that if you start disrespecting your customers you run the risk of them going elsewhere. If the YF elite are happy to have a membership and contributor list of people that all agree or hold particular social views - then ban away or ridicule those with a different view. Without knowing the reasoning behind Thornton Terrace being set up, it would probably of been for something similar, and should they set up their own forum, or someone else do the same, then myself and others would happily jump ship in the hope it was better run than the YF forum is. One of the reasons I do stay is because the vast majority of posters are civil, in many cases humorous and in a lot of cases very knowledgeable, its such a pity some people are none of those things at all and the exact opposite.

Baiter
WeeNix
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 Without knowing the reasoning behind Thornton Terrace being set up, it would probably of been for something similar, and should they set up their own forum, or someone else do the same, then myself and others would happily jump ship in the hope it was better run than the YF forum is.

Bahahahaha ...please, stop.  It hurts.


2ndBest
Moderator
Appiah without the pace
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For post 1620805 10152445803254239 1114551251 n

Out of interest, how could we be more transparent? I can give you a run down of generally how we try to operate.

Firstly, mods don't reads every posts. It’s not possible. We all have families and jobs and other commitments. So if you have a problem with what someone has said, use the 'report' button and tell us why.

Secondly, we try to use hide and warning as much as possible. Usually this is when people have overstepped the mark for the first time. Most of the time, this is a tedious job. We don’t want to be someone’s mother. Sometimes we don’t see posts until well after the fact, which by that stage, the post has already been quoted numerous times or discussion has moved on. So it’s hard to back moderate.

Thirdly, when there is repeat offenders we tend to escalate to banning. We try to note down who these people are and how badly they are behaving, and adjust the length of ban accordingly.

Fourth, if people weren’t dicks and acted with respect we wouldn’t have problems. So people need to take ownership of their own actions. But it's easy to sharkpost under a pseudonym.

Nz_Dave
Moderator
Dinosaur Dave
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For post sentimentaleasyirishdraughthorse

I'm sure another mod will hide this shortly since I'm going rogue but honestly I wasn't being all that snarky then but I'm certainly about to be now. 

Your own post explained how you broke those two rules and a number of other users had pointed exactly that out to you. I simply made it clear which rules they were since it was clarity you seemed to want. If you can't understand how attacking the person directly is a problem then this is probably why you find yourself falling foul of the mods more often. This isn't rocket science. Nor should it be a surprise that repeat offenders might be dealt with more harshly then those who aren't.

No the modding isn't perfect and it never will be - it's almost like there is more than one person doing it and they have different opinions at times and aren't without fault. We don't always get it right, and we certainly don't always agree. We talk about it though behind the scenes and try and reach a consensus where we can. I'm also not going to comment on some long past incident that I have zero knowledge of (given I hadn't even heard of it myself and I'm hardly new round here) but it sounds like no one covered themselves in glory there.. 

However, I will say that being one of the "elite", as so many on here like to brand people doing anything at all to help, is a thankless task. Many on here can attack and criticise from afar, from behind anonymous faceless accounts without any fear of recompense. Those of us brave enough to not only spend hundreds of hours supporting the fans and the club but to use our real name while doing so are often subject to attack. The fact you knew that person's name and place of work to hassle them directly should show you how exposed we are. I know many times I get bowled up to in public to be told how I was wrong about something, there is nothing like a drunken fan yelling in your face to make you question why you bother giving up your time to be thanked by such behaviour. That is to speak nothing of the time I was assaulted on an away trip within NZ by other local fans simply for being "one of those guys from the fan group". Nothing like a bloody football jersey and fist full of police reports to make you feel thanked. This is not isolated the abuse we cop is very real and not just some keyboard warrior nonsense but for the greater good it's not always screamed from the mountain tops.

You want to complain about being treated unfairly because you think you should be able to say whatever you like on a private forum, well cry me a river. The whole internet is available to you to say whatever you want without fear of "YF Elite" censorship - feel free to avail yourself of that right. On here though we have rules and will administer them as we see fit - we can change them at any time and use them more or less harshly as we see fit. We have no obligation at all despite your claims, but choose to operate as openly as we can because none of this is done with anything other than the intent of having a football community that we foster and grow together. It's not a free for all however it is a community and we try and include the community in decisions for that reason.

So unless you have people abusing you in the streets or calling your workplace to explain why what you said on the internet was wrong then honestly I have zero time for you complaining about how hard done you are.

I'm willing to bet there are a fair greater number of people no longer part of this forum because of the cesspit it becomes at times than because of inconsistent modding. In fact more often than not I hear from people that have left the forums that they wish the modding was much more harsh to get rid of some of the shark on here.

Thank you for reminding me why it'd be so much easier to just walk away than bother dealing with any of this.

"He's operating a turnstile down the left flank"

2ndBest
Moderator
Appiah without the pace
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For post 1620805 10152445803254239 1114551251 n

BTW this is the modding whine thread https://www.yellowfever.co.nz/categories/general-a...

Napier Phoenix
Life and death
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Do you have a record of exactly why I was banned on those 2 occasions and what it was I wrote? Unless you do, I doubt that you can provide a great deal of clarity on the specific reasoning behind the ban. I also doubt if you can provide any specific instances of where I have been offensive towards any one or engaging in name calling or aggressive language.

To 2ndBest, if you have a problem with anonymous posting, its entirely within your power to make it a perquisite to forum membership, if you're not prepared to do that, stop insinuating that comments by people who don't reveal their true names are invalid. I work in a role that requires me to retain a level of anonymity in the public forum environment - that should be respected as should any reason that a person choses to remain anonymous. Its not like its a situation where I've made up a name just to post some rabid comment - I've been an active member for almost 12 bloody years. I'm certain some members of the Elite know who I am anyway, one of your close associates knows my name and where I work.

2ndBest
Moderator
Appiah without the pace
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For post 1620805 10152445803254239 1114551251 n

I wasn't saying I have a problem with anonymous posters. I was just implying it's easier to be a dick if you are doing it anonymous. 

It also impossible to force people to put a (correct) name to their posts/account. We introduced a name section in the information section below the avatar in an attempt for people for be more open about who they are and for people to get to know other posters, but very use it and some obviously take the piss.

Napier Phoenix
Life and death
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Nz_Dave wrote:

I'm sure another mod will hide this shortly since I'm going rogue but honestly I wasn't being all that snarky then but I'm certainly about to be now. 

Your own post explained how you broke those two rules and a number of other users had pointed exactly that out to you. I simply made it clear which rules they were since it was clarity you seemed to want. If you can't understand how attacking the person directly is a problem then this is probably why you find yourself falling foul of the mods more often. This isn't rocket science. Nor should it be a surprise that repeat offenders might be dealt with more harshly then those who aren't.

No the modding isn't perfect and it never will be - it's almost like there is more than one person doing it and they have different opinions at times and aren't without fault. We don't always get it right, and we certainly don't always agree. We talk about it though behind the scenes and try and reach a consensus where we can. I'm also not going to comment on some long past incident that I have zero knowledge of (given I hadn't even heard of it myself and I'm hardly new round here) but it sounds like no one covered themselves in glory there.. 

However, I will say that being one of the "elite", as so many on here like to brand people doing anything at all to help, is a thankless task. Many on here can attack and criticise from afar, from behind anonymous faceless accounts without any fear of recompense. Those of us brave enough to not only spend hundreds of hours supporting the fans and the club but to use our real name while doing so are often subject to attack. The fact you knew that person's name and place of work to hassle them directly should show you how exposed we are. I know many times I get bowled up to in public to be told how I was wrong about something, there is nothing like a drunken fan yelling in your face to make you question why you bother giving up your time to be thanked by such behaviour. That is to speak nothing of the time I was assaulted on an away trip within NZ by other local fans simply for being "one of those guys from the fan group". Nothing like a bloody football jersey and fist full of police reports to make you feel thanked. This is not isolated the abuse we cop is very real and not just some keyboard warrior nonsense but for the greater good it's not always screamed from the mountain tops.

You want to complain about being treated unfairly because you think you should be able to say whatever you like on a private forum, well cry me a river. The whole internet is available to you to say whatever you want without fear of "YF Elite" censorship - feel free to avail yourself of that right. On here though we have rules and will administer them as we see fit - we can change them at any time and use them more or less harshly as we see fit. We have no obligation at all despite your claims, but choose to operate as openly as we can because none of this is done with anything other than the intent of having a football community that we foster and grow together. It's not a free for all however it is a community and we try and include the community in decisions for that reason.

So unless you have people abusing you in the streets or calling your workplace to explain why what you said on the internet was wrong then honestly I have zero time for you complaining about how hard done you are.

I'm willing to bet there are a fair greater number of people no longer part of this forum because of the cesspit it becomes at times than because of inconsistent modding. In fact more often than not I hear from people that have left the forums that they wish the modding was much more harsh to get rid of some of the shark on here.

Thank you for reminding me why it'd be so much easier to just walk away than bother dealing with any of this.

Now I've had a full read of your post, I will reply in more detail. I hope you feel better now that you have got that off your chest.

I can tell you now that I do not make a habit of being anti social in any environment, and certainly not in an internet environment under a pseudonym or not. I challenge anyone to provide evidence that I have done that in this forum. The Doloras incident was no more than friendly banter and a continued theme of many discussions - it was so trivial that I can't even recall exactly what it was. The previous ban was surrounding a to and from discussion with Ryan that turned quite juvenile and after my ban I actually pm ed him and suggested we recognise that and move on.

Don't get too upset about the term 'elite' I think it was a title that was first raised in jest and because every time its used, you and others immediately go into 'defence mode' we keep using it, I'm sure many are chuckling at your little rant. 

I appreciate that you all talk about issues raised amongst yourself but I'd be interested in whether or not you actually have some rigorous protocols surrounding how you guys operate. Its easy to keep throwing up the 'we are volunteers' 'it takes up so much of our time' arguments but honestly guys, this YF thing is a big deal and if you are seriously are concerned about what you are giving us all, then you've got to get rid of this siege mentality and address some of the serious concerns some of us have. I'm not seeing that, I'm just seeing a circling of the wagons, the quotation of rules and no real attempt to appreciate what might be valid criticisms or suggestions. Believe me when I say I recognise that type of behaviour, I've worked in that environment for most of my life and it no longer works.

I certainly have sympathy for some of the [sometimes violent] experiences you have because of who you are and what you do with YF, without knowing more than what you said about the supposed motivation for that one incident you cited, do you know or suspect the other reasons for you being verbally attacked? was it because of something you wrote on the forum that might have been perceived as being offensive to that party? I am of the belief that if you are not prepared to say, what you have written, to the face of that person, then you shouldn't say it. While I wouldn't do it now or much longer after I was called a retard, if it had been said to my face the other person would of been drinking their meals through a straw. The argument you put forward re keyboard warriors goes both ways.

You use the phrase "you want to complain" that is not a very accurate description of what I have done; I put forward a point of view that was quite straight forward and it has escalated to this point because you have chosen not to actually address the points raised in a meaningful manner and taken the 'woe is me' route. Are you saying the upshot of my initial comment is that it has no validity because we do this out of the goodness of our hearts, I have no sympathy for you because so many people on the forum are cods and write nasty things? If it was me at your end I'd be having a look of what our rules are, making sure they are still fit for purpose, apply them in a fair and open manner and make sure everyone that is tasked to oversee them does so in a consistent manner. That probably means having some internal protocols for dealing with the rules and any transgressions. If you can put your hand on your heart and say we are pretty consistent in how we apply them - then I think most people in the forum would say you're not seeing what they are seeing.

Consistency and fairness is all I ask from you guys, respect and civility is up to all of us.

2ndBest
Moderator
Appiah without the pace
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For post 1620805 10152445803254239 1114551251 n

this YF thing is a big deal

it's really not.

2ndBest
Moderator
Appiah without the pace
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For post 1620805 10152445803254239 1114551251 n

Given the modding whine thread hasn't had a post in 3.5 years, doesn't that indicate we probably do a pretty decent job? Might not be perfect and I'm sure we get it wrong occassionally. 

We've probably only banned 5 people in the last few years. Even fewer complaints. Out of a few thousand, that's a pretty low number. 

Napier Phoenix
Life and death
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For post image

2ndBest wrote:

this YF thing is a big deal

it's really not.

You might be surprised, there is a real appreciation of what you guys do and there is no substitute for what you do either. Its not always evident and the barbs and arrows take the edge of it for you guys, but its there. We really love you elite guys :) 
Napier Phoenix
Life and death
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2ndBest wrote:

Given the modding whine thread hasn't had a post in 3.5 years, doesn't that indicate we probably do a pretty decent job? Might not be perfect and I'm sure we get it wrong occassionally. 

We've probably only banned 5 people in the last few years. Out of a few thousand, that's a pretty low number. 

Well, 2 of us shouldn't have been lol [I'm counting you here Ryan]

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